What can I pair with red twig dogwood?

[henhen11417]

Hello from Zone 7, and thank you for your help.
I am clearing out overgrown vines and junipers (80% dead) from a steep slope (45 degrees). The slope is 12-17 feet high and 50 feet long, west-south facing, and full sun (7 hours).
My current best idea is to install an evergreen hedge or conifers (undecided) along the top flat area, and a “field” of red twig dogwood. I am hung up on the idea of seeing a “field” of red twig in snow. However, I think the slope needs more than red twig. What can I plant as a partner with the red twig?
A low evergreen cotoneaster?
Low creep juniper?
Liriope – clumping - spreading
Pachysandra
Vinca
Sedum low
Creeping phlox –it would take a lot of phlox.

Thanks for you thoughts. I want to hold the slope and low maint.
Henry

[Newt]

Hi Henry,

That's lots of great information! I think the red twig dogwood would look great and it does tend to sucker and spread out. I'm sure you realize that only the youngest twigs are red, so if you don't get up on that slope once every couple of years to prune the older canes flush to the ground, you won't be seeing as many red twigs as you might like.

First I'm going to comment on your potential selections.

What can I plant as a partner with the red twig?

A low evergreen cotoneaster? - Not a bad idea

Low creep juniper? - This could work

Liriope – clumping - spreading - Either one will need to be sheared once a year in early spring before new growth emerges or it will look tatty in a few years. The clumping varieties will take a long time to spread.

Pachysandra - Slow to spread and I only recommend the native variety. Prefers shade.

Vinca - Escapes into the wild and is invasive. Not good weed suppression.

Sedum low - Great for your conditions but with some denser then others. Careful which ones you select as you will need a mat forming type for weed suppression.

Creeping phlox –it would take a lot of phlox. - Lots of intense colors in the spring. Great groundcover. Here's some.
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...0subulata.html

Here's some other ideas. With such a large expanse consider using 3 different groundcovers. More then that and the site will look too busy. Using 3 different types will allow some depth to the plantings and offer potential bloom at different times. Some of these also have nice fall colors that could be an accent. Also consider planting clumps of early spring bulbs. That will help lift the spirits in late winter or early spring. They can come up through most groundcovers. If you are interested I can suggest some that will perennialize and slowly multiply over the years.

Although there are many natives I'd love to suggest, many aren't good at weed suppression, so I've not included them here. Those with an '*' are native.

**Teucrium canadensis - American germander
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...anadensis.html

Aurinia saxatilis 'Gold Ball' - Basket of gold
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...saxatilis.html

**Carex glauca -Blue sedge, Carnation grass, Glaucous sedge, Heath sedge - a nice blue tint for one area of the slope. Would work well to tie in the blue of **Schizachyrium scoparium 'The Blues' - Little bluestem I mention at the end.
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...%20glauca.html

Petrorhagia saxifraga - Coat flower, Saxifrage pink, Saxifrage tunicflower
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...saxifraga.html

Microbiota decussata - Siberian cypress
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...decussata.html

**Rhus aromatica 'Grow-Low' - no common name other then the 'Grow Low' Rhus.
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...aromatica.html

Laurentia fluviatilis - Blue star creeper
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...uviatilis.html

**Arctostaphylos uva-ursi - has many common names such as bearberry, kinnikinick, Bilberry, Bear's grape and more. There are different cultivars. This first site features Arctostaphylos uva-ursi 'Point Reyes', which doesn't grow as lush as the one below.
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...0uva-ursi.html

**Arctostaphylos uva-ursi 'Massachusetts' has a very different look and a different growth habit. You'll need some patience for this to establish and spread, but a great look. Click on the picture.
http://singtree.com/More.cfm?ID=664

Dianthus deltoides 'Brilliant' - maiden pink ('Brilliant' is only one cultivar, so look for others in shades you prefer.)
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...deltoides.html

Creeping thyme is another great possibility. I once saw a hill covered in just 3 different ones. It looked like a tapestry. It would take some time to fill in, but most are evergreen and form lovely mats. Lots of ideas here too.
http://images.google.com/images?hl=e...-8&sa=N&tab=wi

For a tall groundcover accent, maybe in the lower front of the slope on the outer edges, consider this native ornamental grass. I'd plant a group of 3 or 5 on each outer edge lower corner. With a 50' long run, 5 in each group would probably look better. Planting them there will allow you to easily cut them back in late winter to early spring before new growth emerges. Beautiful fall color. Might work will if you were to plant some **Carex glauca - Blue sedge near the top in the center of the span of the hill to echo the blue tones. The second link is done with different plants, but gives you the idea.

**Schizachyrium scoparium 'The Blues' - Little bluestem
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...scoparium.html
http://www.singtree.com/Design/Image...nLeftImage.gif

Here's some interesting info about groundcovers in California. Most, if not all of these, are hardy in your zone.
http://moonshineink.com/archives.php/50/781

I think the left side of this picture is more interesting then the right because there is more diversity of plantings. It's not a slope, but I think you get the idea.
http://www.allstarlandscapes.com/pic...ALMIA%2015.JPG

In this picture the grass is one type of groundcover and the plantings that encircle it add interest. The grass by itself gives the eye a place to rest.
http://www.allstarlandscapes.com/pic...%20c%20121.jpg

This is very busy.
http://www.homedepot.com/hdus/en_US/...sing_slope.jpg

If you lust after something and can't find it locally, you can check references of mail order nurseries here. You can even search by state or plant material.
http://davesgarden.com/products/gwd/

Newt

[henhen11417]

Thanks much Newt for your time and thoughts.

I took a quick look at the plant suggestions, and will do more over the next few days. Right now, I think I see design issues lurking.
I think my plan was plebian / elementary. I had three elements (an evergreen back drop, and a “field” of red twig mixed with a low companion or cover). I was going to put something right on top of the red twig. The red twig looks so sparse in winter. AND - will it hold the soil while it is establishing ? I glean from your thoughts that I should consider more variety, more elements. Can’t I please stay landscape lazy and garden stoopid?

issue (1). Should the layout be a concentric rows along the curves, or slightly irregular patches of this and that. Is this question the crux of design; like asking how to sculpt a masterpiece? Or do you let the plants dictate the sections / areas and accommodate em?

issue (2). I have been thinking about using “temporary retaining walls”, to hold the soil while the plants establish. I mean using 2-4 inch pruned or dead branches, staked 1, 2 or 3 high. These should rot away in 2-5 years, but by then the plants will be established. Is this smart, buy ugly? Erosion cloth? Straw?

issue (3). I pulled the vines out pretty well, BUT, should I deal now with unknown seeds and vine remnants? How so? Solarize the soil for a month? Apply pre-emegent crabgrass killer?

Thanks again for your time and efforts. Did you have all of these links in a folder?
Are you a Cornell alum?

Cheers
Henry

[Newt]

Henry, you are so very welcome! I enjoyed doing that.

The red twig looks so sparse in winter. AND - will it hold the soil while it is establishing ?

No it won't hold the slope in place as the roots won't have spread enough unless you plant alot of them.

I glean from your thoughts that I should consider more variety, more elements. Can’t I please stay landscape lazy and garden stoopid?

You gave me a giggle with this! It does seem like a long run (50') for just three elements. If it's a view from your house, it could be very boring. I live in zone 7 too, but we don't get much snow cover in winter, which would give more presence to the red twigs.

issue (1). Should the layout be a concentric rows along the curves, or slightly irregular patches of this and that. Is this question the crux of design; like asking how to sculpt a masterpiece? Or do you let the plants dictate the sections / areas and accommodate em?

The type of soil, the sun conditions and the moisture conditions will dictate which plants you can use. Your property and style preference will dictacte how you design this. If you like a formal and controlled look (do you shear your shrubs into unnatural squares, etc?), then less will be more and you'll want symmetry with less plant variety. If your desire is for something interesting to look at with interest in more then one season, then you might want a more informal look. That's why I tried to show you different styles. Try and select what goes with your style and the style of your landscape.

Search google images with terms like:
slope garden
hill garden

Search google with terms like:
landscape hill
landscape slope

issue (2). I have been thinking about using “temporary retaining walls”, to hold the soil while the plants establish. I mean using 2-4 inch pruned or dead branches, staked 1, 2 or 3 high. These should rot away in 2-5 years, but by then the plants will be established. Is this smart, buy ugly? Erosion cloth? Straw?

Great idea! You'll also want to mulch. If you use some type of erosion cloth you will need something that allows for groundcover to spread and plants to emerge through the cloth. Got any pictures of the site?

issue (3). I pulled the vines out pretty well, BUT, should I deal now with unknown seeds and vine remnants? How so? Solarize the soil for a month? Apply pre-emegent crabgrass killer?

This might be a good time for that erosion cloth. You will need to cover the soil as mother nature doesn't like blank spaces and will plant what she wants if you don't. If you use something organic (newspaper) that will break down over time, it will be easier for you when you go to plant. You could put down 6 layers of dampened newspaper and cover with an organic mulch (shredded hardwood is better then large chips as they'll settle together and won't wash away as quickly) until you are ready to plant. Moisten the newpaper as you go, or the first breeze will have you chasing it all over the yard and your neighbors laughing. Been there...

I'm not a fan of synthetic chemicals so I would use corn gluten meal as a pre-emergent.
http://web.extension.uiuc.edu/greenl...295_384.html#3

Thanks again for your time and efforts. Did you have all of these links in a folder?
Are you a Cornell alum?

You are so welcome! Yes, I saved the site in my bookmarks. I have hundreds where I can search for what I'm looking for by a keyword. Here's the main page.
http://www.entomology.cornell.edu/Ex...coverMain.html

No, I'm not a Cornell alumni, just a gardener who loves to share what I've learned. I love the environment and have great concern for it.

I think I've answered all your questions. If not, let me know. I'll be away for the weekend and probably won't have computer access, so if you write in and don't get a response before Tuesday, that is why.

Newt

[Newt]

Henry, I was thinking about your situation and I wonder if winterberry holly aka Ilex verticillata might be something you might like. It's deciduous, but if you plant at least one or two males you will have lots of berries for the birds and the red berries look great against the snow. It also looks nice in winter with an evergreen behind it.
http://www.claytonvnps.org/wildflowe...lliplowres.jpg
http://plantsbulbs.suite101.com/arti..._holly___fruit
http://images.google.com/images?hl=e...mages&aq=f&oq=

Newt

[isabella]

Hi

This is really exciting, as I have a similar situation in my landscape.

I have a slope about 40 degrees and 16 high but only 27 feet long.

I have planted evergreens at the top of the slope ( colorado blue spruce and PJM rhodies). On the slope I have several varities of red twigs. Solid greens and variegated leaves. I opted for bands of colored leaves... variegated at top and solid leaves on the bottom. For the winter interests in the center of the mass of red twigs (actually burgandy stems) I put in yellow twigs and red-twig cardinals. It is newlly installed, so I'm waiting still for the growth to take off! At the base of the slope I have Nova Rhodies and PJMS and a mugo pine and some Tavida off to the corner. As a groundcover I put in vinca minor. My idea was that with time the RTs will shade out the weeds and the vinca will survive for a green contrast against the RTs. I planned to never climb the slope after planting these and simply let the weeds grow, as they are holding the slope. This area is not part of my "curb appeal" so I can take a more leisurly approach to maintenance. However, my no weeding plan was thwarted by Jap. or giant knotweed!! It is helping to hold the slope for now, but it is terribly invasive!! I have been climbing the hill for maintenance at least once a week to cut down the knotweed .

I also planted spring bulbs like daffodils that are low-maintenance to help put in some roots to hold the slope. Apparently on my slope there is considerable seed-bank as jewelweed and woodland poppy are coming up. Those will be dealt with in time by the growing RTs .

My choice for the layerd look was to mimic a horizon effect to pull eye to the center of the slope. In winter I am hoping to have a yellow spot visible above a layer of evergreen and surrounded by burgandy red. We'll see how it works out !


Good luck with your planting, and watch out for knotweed!

[Newt]

Hi Isabella,

Your planting scheme sounds exciting. You don't say where you live, but in the US, woodland poppy is native and I'd leave it alone. Less to pull out. Vinca is also an invasive here, so if you have planted it near a woodland or a stream, watch that it doesn't get out of control and spread into those areas.

I'd love to see pics of your planting.

Newt